Voice Over Host 0:02
This is the best or worst podcast. And now here are your hosts Koji, Stephen Sekai and M Martin Mapoma.
M. Martin Mapoma 0:13
All right, welcome. Welcome. Welcome. This is the best or worst podcast. My name is Martin.
Koji Sakai 0:18
My name is Koji
M. Martin Mapoma 0:20
and a little delay there like
Koji Sakai 0:21
Sorry, sorry.
M. Martin Mapoma 0:22
Okay. And today we are talking with Jonesy who was a who was actually on our legacy team.
Koji Sakai 0:28
No dynasty fantasy football. He’s not on our team. He’s in our league.
M. Martin Mapoma 0:38
No, no, I meant to say you know, our dynasty league. Yeah.
Koji Sakai 0:41
Clear and declare also it’s his full name. If you guys are looking him up is Chris. Jonesy Jones. So welcome.
Guest: Jonesy 0:47
Thank you so much for having me guys.
M. Martin Mapoma 0:49
Jonesy Jones.
Guest: Jonesy 0:50
I’m so excited. So excited to be on episode number 33 of this. This podcast. It’s an honor to be on here.
Koji Sakai 0:56
And you have a you’re a comedian and actor, writer and podcaster What can you tell us about yourself?
Guest: Jonesy 1:02
Oh yeah, I began as a musician actually in Boston and then transitioned into comedy because I thought that would be much easier of a career. Wow, difficult. So yeah, but I really liked it because it was so difficult. It was such a challenge. being on stage doing stand up comedy is one of the most difficult roles that you can play in our culture. And it was thrilling. And then I began make getting good at it and making money at it and continue to do it. It brought me to New York City, where I continue to do stand up comedy but then also started to act as well. I was fortunate enough to be on some some TV shows like Gotham and Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt, and Nurse Jackie and Blue Bloods in drunk history, and did some theater as well and moved to LA four years ago to continue the acting and comedy and started the recording and producing my own podcast five days a week called when you read as news Yeah, Wied AF news is I do three weird news stories a day Monday through Friday. I just recently surpassed 700 episodes and I’m hitting a million downloads and a few months from now. And that’s, that’s been keeping me busy during the lockdown. I can say because I have had I haven’t had a show since March 11. Haven’t had an audition since February. And so it looks like all that stuff’s on hold for now. So just the podcast is what I’ve been doing, and I’m pushing that forward. Now. I’m looking to expand it and spend my time learning about how to market podcasts and the kind of stuff that you guys did.
M. Martin Mapoma 2:36
Koji does. He’s good at that. I see. Are you in the Chicago Bulls shirt? You live in Chicago for a while?
Guest: Jonesy 2:42
No, I’m a Boston fan. I’m from Boston mass. I’m a huge Celtics fan, but I you know, I’ve watched I just watched that last dance. You know, I broke up my Bulls shirt, which I’ve had for a bit and I just been in I’ve been feeling Jordan lately, really, was really motivating that show. I don’t know if you guys have watched it yet. It’s just like That that will get you going and whatever you’re doing in life because Never have I seen a fella so driven, you know, it’s just it’s just unbelievable. It reminds me of this, this this like, Bruce Lee quote that I heard a long, long time ago where he said something like that. There’s no extraordinary men. There’s just regular men with with like a laser focus, you know, and that’s Yeah, and this is what Jordan is. Of course he is an extraordinary man. He has a lot of talent but I mean, nobody has the focus that he had looked at what he did. I mean, when you and seeing him behind the scenes, it just really got me going. So I’ve been wearing my Bulls shirt. And
M. Martin Mapoma 3:40
I say that it’s because one of my one of my college buddies, I went to Kentucky and one of my friends played for Kentucky. And he was Mr. Basketball in Florida back in the early 80s. And he went to before they hadn’t gone McDonald’s American classic. He went to a U was it was a U-10 I could be wrong. No, no, sorry. Oh, somebody else Anyway, but he went to a basketball camp, and with all the top players in the country, and as a treat, they had Jordan come in. And he he had a very interesting story about playing with Jordan. And he said, Yeah, he was the kind of guy he just came into the crush you. He didn’t care if you were a high school or a middle schooler. He was there to beat you. And he actually jacked my buddy’s shoulder up. And, you know, you know, and he just has it’s a very interesting story. When he talks about he talks about Jordan’s laser focus, he goes he is he said, he said, Jordan is the alpha male personified.
Guest: Jonesy 4:35
Yeah, sure
M. Martin Mapoma 4:36
that personified everything about and there’s no, there’s no mercy. No, you’re not not that easy. A bad. You mean guy, whatever. He just, there’s just no mercy. For a second place.
Koji Sakai 4:45
It’s like Kobe Bryant. Kobe Bryant had that same?
M. Martin Mapoma 4:48
Yeah. You had to bring up Kobe.
Guest: Jonesy 4:49
I was gonna ask him. I was gonna ask you Koji. I mean, do you do you think that Have you always thought that Jordan was above Kobe?
Koji Sakai 4:56
Oh, for sure. I mean, I think Kobe. I think he’s a top 10 player. I don’t think he’s in the top 5. Yeah. To be honest, I mean, I I love KobeI love the Lakers, but I gotta be real you know what I actually do? I think that what I’ve been saying about this whole LeBron and Michael debate is that I think if if LeBron manages went to the Lakers, I think winning with three different teams is a three different teams and the way he’s done it is something because, you know, basketball is just different now, you know, than it was back then. But I do want to say one thing that you know, one of the great one of the things about having to be six, six or six nine, is that you know, is that you have to you have to want it in the NBA, right? You have to be you have to want to be the amazing player. That’s why I’d never trust players that get drafted who are seven feet tall. Because you’re seven feet tall. That’s literally the only thing you could do was to play basketball. You don’t have to you don’t want you don’t need to want it as bad as like a Kobe at Six’ Six” was like I mean, he’s obviously an amazing athlete, but there’s a lot of amazing athletes of six’ six” right?
M. Martin Mapoma 6:00
Yeah, well, I mean, I think when you start getting past 6′ 6″ 6′ 7″ 6′ 8″ basketballs usually your go to, yeah, well,
Koji Sakai 6:06
but what I’m saying is that you need you need the passion, you need something that separates you from from everybody else.
M. Martin Mapoma 6:11
Oh, without a doubt, without a doubt, you know, except you know, when I was a kid, you know, younger when I first graduated I worked in a Jordan’s restaurant in Chicago, so I was there for he was there for two of his… I was there on and off. So I was there for like, two of his championships. And I met him quite a few times. I did a commercial with him to for Nike. Back then, as well. And it was funny because he recognized me from his restaurant. He was always cool to me. He was always a cool guy. He came to our, you know, Christmas parties, you know, played pool with us.
Guest: Jonesy 6:38
That’s tremendous. That’s so tremendous.
Koji Sakai 6:40
Yeah. And we won’t, but we won’t hold it against you God for being a Boston fan. I mean, you know, thank you. You’re You’re 16 championships are A is BS because they happened before basketball was really basketball. I just want to put that out there. We’re about where the Lakers are about to get 16 this year.
Guest: Jonesy 6:55
So in one of your championships is from Minnesota as well so we could talk about that.
Koji Sakai 7:01
You have like ten from back in the day. There’s like 12 teams dude.
Guest: Jonesy 7:08
True. It’s true. Very true.
Koji Sakai 7:10
And you have like 8 Hall of Famers on your life. Because it’s like
M. Martin Mapoma 7:13
Koji, do you think that? You think Michael was the best number one right without a doubt?
Koji Sakai 7:18
Yeah, I mean, I think it’s between Michael and LeBron. I think Lebron’s career is not over. I mean,
M. Martin Mapoma 7:22
I think Michael still number one, I would think I is just Jordan man.
Koji Sakai 7:27
Yeah. And also, I don’t think it’s clear cut like if, for example, I think of Stephen A Smith, who I don’t really love Steven A Smith. But he, he did say a good thing. If you’re like an alpha male player. If you’re like an amazing basketball player, you probably want to play LeBron. Not Michael, can you play with a Lebron,, If you play LeBron, he’ll pass you the ball. Like
M. Martin Mapoma 7:42
Yeah, yeah.
Guest: Jonesy 7:44
Yeah, this is this is what that was carries beef, of course, as well. Yeah, I mean, I think I think personally, anybody who watches this Jordan documentary, I don’t think there’s really an argument anymore. It really solidified it for me that there’s no no it’s hands down.
Koji Sakai 7:56
Well, but also we haven’t seen what Lebron’s rest of his career is like right I mean,
If he wins a couple more championships. I mean, it’s just, there’s a lot more. Like I think basketball is different. I don’t know if you heard. I actually recently went back and watched the 90’s basketball game. And it was terrible. I watched the Knicks Miami and then I watched it Indiana Knicks sir Indiana Bulls series. It was tear. I mean, it was like the basketball was just not that good back then. It was slow.
Guest: Jonesy 8:00
True True
M. Martin Mapoma 8:22
How can you say that?
Koji Sakai 8:23
It was no basketball because there was so much about five minutes so much is so physical. Like they actually didn’t shoot the ball out like they were there were times on the court where six of the ten players couldn’t shoot the ball past like four feet. That was like miserable. If you have one player on the basketball court that can’t shoot that guy’s getting a guy’s gonna get like killed out there.
Guest: Jonesy 8:43
Well, there certainly wasn’t as much scoring and I’m learning that by watching that doc I mean all these playoff games you know the scores are most of them are under 100 per team, which you don’t really see that ever anymore. It’s it was different. It was much much different. No one yeah, threes, really I mean it was it was quite different.
Koji Sakai 9:00
Yeah, like now you need a center shoot three, right like you need.
Guest: Jonesy 9:03
Yeah, you’re shooting threes 100% you’re sending needs to shoot threes now it’s crazy. I mean,
Koji Sakai 9:09
there was like, I was watching those, like Knicks games were like, literally like the three forwards, couldn’t shoot the ball. And you’re just like, Damn, this is crazy. Like, you guys look like they’re basically just out there to like, hit you. And it was just the way basketball was was like, they come down the court.
M. Martin Mapoma 9:24
That was Detroit, man, Detroit, you know,
Koji Sakai 9:26
they come down the court and then they’d like get fouled, they go and they go the free throw line. And then like they run back the other way. And then they’d be like, they use 24 23 of the 24 seconds like now it’s like basketball Pass Pass Pass Pass wide open three. Yeah, like then you go run down the court you Pass Pass Pass like you know, everybody is like it’s crazy. It’s anyway and
Guest: Jonesy 9:45
every every any player can is capable of averaging 20 a game any any player can do it. But you look back then that wasn’t the case watching that Utah series against the bulls with the ball always went to Karl Malone, the only guy that can Really score Karl Malone just by
M. Martin Mapoma 10:02
mail man.
Guest: Jonesy 10:03
Yeah. And I mean you’re like, wow, this is that was they built the team around this one the one guy
M. Martin Mapoma 10:07
Wait, wait, wait, hold on a second real quickly. Karl Malone was Moses Malone was mailman, right.
Koji Sakai 10:11
No, Karl Karl Malone was okay.
M. Martin Mapoma 10:13
Just making just double checking. Hey, I don’t want to be wrong on here, man. This stuff is forever dude. The mailman.
Guest: Jonesy 10:20
The mailman. Okay, so and then, you know, now anybody on any team can average 20 if they’re just given if they’re the ball when the ball goes, I mean, the ball just moves around and everybody’s capable of scoring shows. Yeah, different. So different.
Koji Sakai 10:33
Why don’t you talk to us a little bit about your comedy a little bit what kind of what kind of comedy do you do? Like, like I
Guest: Jonesy 10:41
So the what kind of comedy do I do? I like, all my stuff is autobiographical, and most of it is grievances, my grievances I’ve turned into comedy, you know, so a lot of just complaining is what it comes down to be like this. This is stupid. In our culture, this pisses me off. This is why this is why my life sucks right now. This is why, you know I don’t hang out with these people. This is why I chose to live here and I hate this place. It’s all stuff like that. So mostly grievances.
M. Martin Mapoma 11:16
you’re agregieved. Yeah. What about a Gotham who you on Gotham?
Guest: Jonesy 11:21
so I was in season one I played a character called Carl Smikers I was an episode call called balloon man and I was a bad guy.
M. Martin Mapoma 11:30
What did you cuz I love Gotham I watched it religiously.
Guest: Jonesy 11:33
Yeah, yeah, you so episode three or four i think is what I’m in the first first season the very first season. I think it’s for the fourth three or four.
M. Martin Mapoma 11:41
Yeah, were you killed by JD Pincus guy?
Guest: Jonesy 11:44
I was not. No, I wasn’t. I wasn’t killed. I wasn’t killed. Oh, I was taken in though. There was I was taking I was beat up by Ben McKenzie. We had a nice fight scene which was quite fun. He basically just tackled me and punched me a few times and brought me in Yeah. So that Yeah, season one you enjoyed the show?
M. Martin Mapoma 12:04
Oh, yeah, I do. I’m a big comic book fan. So and I love Batman.
Guest: Jonesy 12:09
Because a lot of the big comic book fans told me like, yeah, I’m a big comic book fan. I didn’t like that show. They didn’t blah, blah, blah. And I’m like, Hey, dude, I didn’t write the damn thing. So I don’t know how to get out of here.
M. Martin Mapoma 12:19
Yeah, no, I know, a lot of I know a lot of fans like that. I’m not that way. I’ll you know, I’ll watch anything on Batman, regardless of you know, whether it’s good or not, just because I love Batman. And I mean, first of all, you know, people have a hard time with I keep, I keep telling them, Hey, this is not the real world. Okay.
Guest: Jonesy 12:35
Sure. Sure.
M. Martin Mapoma 12:36
So there’s a lot of there’s a lot of you know, of license sticking with it.
Guest: Jonesy 12:42
To me, storytelling for film and TV is just so much different than anything else, and tweaks have to be made. Especially now when you know, you’re competing with everything that can come up on your phone these days. So you’re competing when you make a show. You’re I mean, Koji? You know, this. You You got to compete with podcasts you got to compete with everything that’s come through your phone so you got to make these these things have to grab you and you sometimes have to you know people don’t want the truth anymore they want the interesting truth and if that means taking some liberties you have to do that to maintain their attention
Oh, I was just like I think if if you’re doing something that like Star Wars or something in the Marvel or even DC stuff like there is a there’s like a there is like a you know like a like a lore that you do have to follow like that’s my big thing with Joker I hate it is that like like like that doesn’t even make sense that Joker was thought he was a kid bristle you know, Bruce Wayne’s dad like that doesn’t that doesn’t make any sense. Like,
I’m not familiar with that. And so I was wondering about that. So he’s not that wasn’t his dad in according to the to the Batman lore at all.
M. Martin Mapoma 13:51
No, no one really knows no one really knows where it came from. Because in true Batman fashion, Joker is Joker. There are no records of where Joker came from, nor really No records of where Joker came from. Yeah.
Koji Sakai 14:01
But if you look at the age wise, it just doesn’t work. Like Yeah,
M. Martin Mapoma 14:05
but then yeah, but that’s the thing. It’s, you know, no one knows.
Koji Sakai 14:09
Well, no, the killer in the in the what is the joker? The Killing book? Is that what it is? I’ll have to have to look it up but I thought they had an origin story and that and that anyway, I do think I would. My point is,
M. Martin Mapoma 14:20
The legend of the Dark Knight you mean
Koji Sakai 14:22
No, no, no. there’s a there’s a joker The Joker graphic novel. But
M. Martin Mapoma 14:26
no, no, no, I have it.
Koji Sakai 14:29
But I don’t remember what my point being that like, there’s like a, I think you have to, you know, like, like, for example, like in Star Wars, everything there’s like, like all the Clone Wars. Like, which is the comic, or the cartoon version works within the world of Star Wars like the last last season does. Yeah, no everything else does. I shouldn’t
M. Martin Mapoma 14:47
Yeah.
Koji Sakai 14:48
I mean, um, we watch all of them really does but but you know, like, I think it’s like, like the books usually do unless it’s like, but anyway, anyway, I think we’re getting way way far off field here. But
M. Martin Mapoma 14:59
I do want to say One last thing talking about… then I’ll stop you’re right, you’re right about taking license because you know you’re competing with so many things. When you do film and television, it’s like x men, you know, they were all in the, you know, in the comics, they always wear yellow outfits. And a lot of people had a hard time with that in the movies, but putting them in yellow spandex would not have worked.
Guest: Jonesy 15:17
So when you’re making these things as a producer, I’d imagine you come up with a challenge. And the challenge is how do I make this super interesting for anybody to watch? And then how do I remain loyal to a certain fan base that’s already invested in
M. Martin Mapoma 15:29
a very large fan base.
Guest: Jonesy 15:31
Yeah, yeah. So that can be tricky. I’d imagine Martin
Koji Sakai 15:35
Marvel and Disney has a good job of that. I thought, I believe in a great job. They’ve done a great job. They really am sorry, Joney, I cut you off. What were you gonna say?
Guest: Jonesy 15:42
I was gonna say personally for me, I don’t I’m not a big comic book and superhero person. So I don’t I never I don’t have a dog in any of these fights. So I know but I hear people complaining. You know, and like for my first person experience being on that Gotham show I encountered a lot of fans were just like, Man that show no, no And I’m like, Alright, I’m sorry, I just I’ve witnessed the passion of the fans and stuff that’s been taken out on me a little bit. And so it’s, it’s, uh, yeah, so I can see how upset they can get if you don’t stick to certain traditions.
Koji Sakai 16:15
Yeah, I mean, that’s the challenge whenever you do anything, that’s that’s a popular work. So that’s why they always say that a good book is hard to turn into a good movie, because you have so many fans who want to see every part of the book that they love in the movie. And the problem The good thing about bad books is bad books. You could just take the the gist of the book,
M. Martin Mapoma 16:38
and make into a great movie.
Koji Sakai 16:39
Yeah, like Godfather, like Mario Puzo’s book is terrible. It’s like one of the worst books I’ve ever read, because I was a terrible writer. And, you know, like, but that movie was awesome. Because they took they took that like, they took the parts that were best and kind of molded. Nobody read the book, so nobody cares. Like whereas if you read like Harry Potter, it’s like, oh, no, like I miss this character. I missed this interaction. I love these characters but in the movie that’s why I like ultimately if you look at my series they end up being like two movies a book because you just had to put needs to fit so much shit, right?
Guest: Jonesy 17:08
Oh yeah, well, sure. I mean in more appropriately a short story works better as a feature film, a book a novel that’s a series that’s really because there’s just so many characters and there’s so many various plots and storylines that you’re getting a novel that you cannot fit. And that’s everybody’s biggest gripe when they make a movie out of a huge novel there’s so much is left out that they’re like I can’t believe they didn’t do this and I can’t believe in it’s already a short story. That’s why you see so many Stephen King’s short stories are made into movies like Shawshank Redemption, you know, the most famous one because short stories really work better for a structurally Yes,
Koji Sakai 17:45
yeah, absolutely. That’s why I mean that’s why now not to get too much in the industry stuff but it’s the most of what people are pitching now are limited series 6 to 8 Episode One hour pieces. So we have like a really long it’s a really long movie, basically. Right where like, I could help now with eight hours I could get into like every single character and every single story and really, really get into it. I mean, I think all my pitches recently have been all these kind of miniseries is there’s
M. Martin Mapoma 18:11
a lot of them out there.
Guest: Jonesy 18:12
And you get you’re getting Are you getting them from novels yourself that
Koji Sakai 18:15
some of them are novels some or other things, but like, those are all like the way stories are they want to, like, everybody wants to hear those kinds of stories, right? Because it’s just, it’s just a little bit more in depth, but it’s limited like you don’t watch 100 episodes of this. It’s like within within a realm of like, you could watch it conceivably in over a weekend kind of thing is
Guest: Jonesy 18:33
I prefer that kind of content as well. Personally, I like I really don’t want to commit to, you know, 20 to 30 episodes. I really like the weekend binge is nice for me six episodes. A lot of these docu series have been like that. So I really love that like the Jordan ones 10 episode. This is great, because that
M. Martin Mapoma 18:51
is that available somewhere now?
Guest: Jonesy 18:53
So it was it. I’ve been watching it on prime wire with a VPN
M. Martin Mapoma 19:00
like Amazon Prime? Or?
Guest: Jonesy 19:01
No It’s like this, like a site that has every TV show and film but you’re not supposed to watch. It’s like kind of pirated kind of thing. I started, and I started watching the Beastie Boys. I started watching that on there last night and I’m about it. I’m only about 45 minutes in. It’s tremendous, man.
M. Martin Mapoma 19:20
I can’t wait to watch that. Oh, man, I watching this a show called it’s a Korean show called The king. Eternal monarch. And I gotta tell you, man, those shows coming out of Korea are really good. Yeah, If you guys get a chance to watch it, and it’s it’s subtitled obviously. But, um, you know, Netflix is doing this thing now where they have a whole they have like a Filipino category, you know, Korean category. So my wife, you know, loves that kind of stuff. And she’s Filipino. But we started watching the scene. We watched one Korean show was really good. And then we saw she found this one called the king. And I gotta tell you, man, it’s like six. We’re 16 episodes in or whatever. It’s riveting. It I can’t tell you how good it is. So, yeah, the king eternal monarch on Netflix. They better pay me for that one. All right, moving on. Alright, so Koji, we’ve talked to Jonesy for Jesus about 25 minutes here. I’m thinking that I want to ask him the worst experience it was life.
Koji Sakai 20:22
Why do you want him to say the worst?
M. Martin Mapoma 20:25
Well, because you’ve been doing the best all the time. I don’t know. I mean, doesn’t seem like a really upbeat guy.
Guest: Jonesy 20:31
Yet, I got a good story if you’d like to if you’d like to hear about my the worst. Okay.
M. Martin Mapoma 20:36
Did you do you agree with me, Koji?
Koji Sakai 20:38
yeah, let’s do that. Let’s hear your worst.
Guest: Jonesy 20:40
So the worst. I was driving I drive cross country from California to Massachusetts. After this was after graduating high school, I did a little road trip thing and on my way back I had a friend with me who wasn’t, he was a bad influence. And we had packed the vehicle with narcotics and booze. I mean, these are the essentials in a road trip, right? I mean, you don’t want to travel through a lot of these states sober. Really? Do you want to be in Montana sober? I mean, really, some of these places. We got pulled over halfway through halfway across the country in Wichita, Kansas. My buddy had a warrant in Massachusetts, where we’re from, he thought that the warrant might translate cross state. So he was worried that he was going to be taken in if he gave him his real name. So he gave gave them a fake name. And he had no he had no ID for this fake name. The police were very suspicious. They asked permission to search the vehicle which we denied. They, they, they said well, okay then wait here and they, they came back with dogs and they searched our entire vehicle with two dogs and they found some marijuana and they found some, some, some booze, you know, and we were 19 years old. We were under age. They didn’t find the meth. Luckily, they find the meth. I had hit it quite well, and it’s the dogs didn’t find it. I can’t believe it to this day, we would have done more time than we did in Kansas. But because we were caught with a significant amount of marijuana and booze and we were under age, and I had a Massachusetts license plate, they you know, they they brought us in and gave us the business. I was told that it was a This was probably the most humiliating moment in my life, where I was forced to complete strip completely naked and a grown man’s sprayed me down with a hose. This is before they give you your your prison gear. Yes and I mean you talk about humiliation to be completely naked in front of another grown man as he sprays you down with a hose like not even like a nice spray you know you when you’re running around the backyard and with your cousin in the summertime like Yeah, no, this was opposite this was like trying to spray the skin of my balls. And then so then I’m giving my my prison prison gear. And I haven’t seen my buddy we were separated, I didn’t know where the hell they were taking him he was, seemed to me to be more in more trouble than me, although I was the owner of the vehicle. So I mean, I was sort of culpable as well. I got, you know, just kind of, here’s my clothes, here’s your sandals. You know, this is like a real prison thing. And then they push you into this big room and I go in there and you open the door and I go in and I’m just like there’s all these I enter that during like recess or some Like all these prisoners are in the main area, sitting at tables, playing cards, doing whatever and they all eyes just turn. I mean, like, hundreds of people just turn like hundreds of it’s kind of scary people just turn to look at me now I’m, I look young for my age now, you know, I mean, when you should have seen me when I was 19 I mean, I looked like I was a 15 year old skateboarder kid, I had this long blonde hair. I mean, I just looked so young, you know, but for me to walk into a prison was just like, it was jaw dropping for everybody there, you know, clearly, like, what is this child doing here? You know? And then I, you know, I went to myself, got my toothpaste out and put everything in and I just sat in my cell and I was like, I didn’t know what to do. And I knew that I had to, I couldn’t just sit in the cell. I thought I’d go out you know, and kind of maybe mingle with people. I what I really wanted to do is find my buddy john and figure out what the hell was happening with him. I had no idea how I was how long I was going to be in here. I didn’t know what they were doing with him and I eventually mosey on out and I, you know, I’m kind of a personal guy, I’m a good conversationalist, so I was able to sort of figure out my way and I of course, I had this very thick Boston accent which was made me instantly hilarious to everybody. You know, they just couldn’t get enough of this Boston accent. They just would like say that again. Can you keep talking? I mean, I really thick Boston accent very comical. I was a comical character to all of them, you know, so I mean, cut to a few hours later, you know, I make friends with a pimp named Easy Lee Coleman. And he helps me out. He teaches me how to play spades. I’m playing spades with people. I’m listening to their stories about how they ended up in there what they do, you know, I mean, and I’m meeting some crazy people, man, these people are like, this is like rural Kansas. These people are into some crazy weird ass shit, you know? You know, like, like, incest. Then, you know moonshining and making meth and like they’re telling me all kinds of stuff. I’m having the time of my life by the time the night rolls around. And finally I see my buddy john he happens to be he happens to come in you know, and and we were able to get together and have a powwow about the situation but we were very frightened. We didn’t know how long we were going to be there how we’re going to get out. We were totally had to wait to see the judge for days. So I know at least be there four days. And, you know, it’s it’s a frightening experience for you know, basically a teenager who had never I’d never really had any trouble with the law prior to that really ever outside of like a speeding ticket. And I witnessed some some, some stuff too. That was a little like bananas. Like for instance during during lunch one time some guy asked me if he could have my tater tots. So I said, Yeah, take them. So he actually took my tots. And then right after he took the tots me It was like, like, action like that, like two of the guards came over and just dragged him like that he got in huge trouble for taking the tots and they like you know, it almost went through it almost they almost beat the guy you know for taking the tots I guess you’re not supposed to take other people’s food or whatever. So, I mean, it was a frightening little moment there. And it’s, you know, now whenever I see tots, it’s just a weird experience because, you know, it was tots bring joy to everybody, right? You see tots you like, yeah, we taught, like, I see tots. I’m like, oh, man, that dude that got dragged away and almost beat to death. But taking my tots moments like that. Were kind of like, Whoa, what were you know, just sobering moments of like, Oh, yeah, that’s right. I’m in a jail forgot about that. People ask me sometimes I’m like, hey, so did you get Did you get raped in jail? They always want to know did you get raped in jail? Of course, I was afraid that that might happen because of how I looked. I had long blonde hair. Like I look very pretty, you know, like, you know, like, like imagine me 19 Big Blue Eyes long blonde hair get not a big build on me, you know and so frightening place for me. But no, I never got I never got raped and I never got right because I went in with a plan. And I stuck to the plan and the plan was I never showered. I never showered, I didn’t shower one time. I was there for days. I never showered one time. You know, it’s like it so that my philosophy was you can’t bend over to pick up the soap if you never if you never holding it in the first place. You know, that was my approach to that.
Koji Sakai 28:34
So how did you get out then?
Guest: Jonesy 28:36
So eventually we we, we were told we were being what’s called wopped out w o p p d, something like that wopped out. So after four days, I guess there was the judge was so inundated with cases that they were letting some of the like, I guess the non violent cases out and so We were me and john, were were part of that. JOHN. I got let out charges drop, no sweat. I could go on my way, john, because he lied to law enforcement. He had something else to deal with. And he was supposed to go back to Kansas to appear for court later in that year. And I don’t think he did. And to this day, he probably has a thing with Kansas. I’m not sure but yes, so
M. Martin Mapoma 29:26
That’s crazy.
Guest: Jonesy 29:28
So another another little little anecdote that is kind of fun is so Easy Lee Coleman, the pimp that I made friends with, he was such a nice guy, man, he like cut my hair to get me ready for the judge and shit. You know, because I had this long hair. He’s like, Man, you look like a fucking stoner, bro. You got caught with weed, right? You’re gonna cut your hair, man. You cut my hair for me. He let me speak to his wife on the phone. Because I was kind of feeling down and he’s like, let it totally talk to my wife. And her name. His name is Janice Coleman. I’ll never forget it. She was so sweet. She cheered me up until this day, I always wonder like, how like, like, how can a pimp have a wife? Like it just blows my mind that he had a wife like this is like gonna be the most tolerant woman in the world that she would be married to a pimp. You know, I have I’ve had girlfriends that are uncomfortable when I play co Ed softball like nevermind Pam, Janice Coleman I don’t know where she is, but um,
M. Martin Mapoma 30:23
Was he was he like a rural pimp or like a big city pimp? He was a local pimp Yeah.
Guest: Jonesy 30:33
He heard you say rural pimp
Koji Sakai 30:35
that’s that’s hilarious. Well, I was gonna I was gonna ask you what what what precipitated the stop was it just because you had different plates for different state or was it…?
Guest: Jonesy 30:43
so when you’re when you’re driving across the country, you know, you the highways that go you’re going from 65 mile an hour limits, and then you would hit this town right? So you know nothing and nothing, nothing nothing for hours and miles and miles and all of a sudden the town would come up and the town is so The speed limit will go from 65 to 35. Like really quickly, so you have to really be on it, you know to be oh shit go down. Well, you know, if you’re if you’ve been driving, you know, we were taking meth and we hadn’t stopped driving. We’ve been driven super
M. Martin Mapoma 31:14
serious about that?
Guest: Jonesy 31:15
We were Yeah, yes, we were driving for two days straight. Like, we hadn’t slept almost two days. I mean, it had to be it was like, 30 something hours of straight driving from California, because of the meth because of the meth, but we were kind of like, we by then we were very loopy. You know, we were Oh, and so you know, to be on point and, and, and shift down to that speed limit in time. You know, we just got caught on one of them. And we got Massachusetts license plates. So you know, the cops like, what are these Yankees doing? You know what I mean? Like, I think there’s a lot of that going on. And so it’s like, you know, let’s let’s, let’s take these kids from Boston and let’s let’s find out what’s going on. And this is a little suspicious. Another fun anecdote about this. I was supposed to meet I’d made this friend Online Her name was Angela and she lived in Olathe, Kansas, which is about two hours away from Wichita where we got arrested. Our plan was to drive all the way to Angela, and she was going to let us stay at her place and she’s going to make us a homemade meal. We could swim in her pool. That’s why we were driving. We thought, oh, we’ll drive nonstop to Angela’s house in Olathe, Kansas, take a break, eat and then the next day, we’ll drive the rest of the way to Massachusetts. Now, I had only been friends with Angela online and spoken to her over the phone we had never met in person. This was going to be the first time I’d ever meet this girl. That was very excited to do so she was just a beautiful country girl. So we you know, I have her phone number like we’re gonna we’re going to I’ll see you. I’ll let you know we’re going to be arriving but we don’t arrive. So she has no clue what the hell is going on. I call her from prison. I say Angela, we didn’t make it. We don’t make it to your house. All right. We’re in Wichita, Kansas in prison. She, she immediately gets out of work. Okay, she just tells her tells her boss, I gotta go I got an emergency. She drives two hours to the Wichita prison to meet me. And the first time we’d ever seen each other face to face was through the glass on the phone. That’s the first time we’d ever seen each other face to face bench and each other’s presence was talking on that prison phone through the glass. I’m in an orange jumpsuit, and she is gorgeous. She’s gorgeous. That’s how much game I got. That’s how much she was so wonderful.
M. Martin Mapoma 33:44
most people. That’s a great story. So this is your worst? Most people would call up a girl they met online. And the minute you say your prison, click
Guest: Jonesy 33:59
We had an ongoing months, months and months of relationship online. I had met her through my job. And so she was somebody that had to do business with over the phone for months and months and months. And so we had it. We were always talking, but then we kicked it up a notch and had been talking on video and whatnot. But we were never in each other’s presence until that moment. Yeah, I mean, it there’s a little silver lining to that, you know, little things like that had happened. But I mean, it was the scariest time of my life, for sure was just being in there. I didn’t know what was gonna happen. Certainly, the whole the whole arrival into prison and being brought into the prison was like, I mean, just shit your pants, man. I’m just I’m losing it.
M. Martin Mapoma 34:42
I’m gonna tell you right now, Jonesy. If that was my story, they never would have found my body.
Guest: Jonesy 34:48
Yeah,
M. Martin Mapoma 34:49
I’ll tell you that right now, dude,
Guest: Jonesy 34:50
right.
Koji Sakai 34:51
Here. Here’s a question.
M. Martin Mapoma 34:52
That’s how white folks go to jail.
Guest: Jonesy 34:54
Yeah.
Koji Sakai 34:56
Here’s a quick question. So what how does this How does this experience affect you now? I mean, does it does it still affect you in any way or…?
M. Martin Mapoma 35:03
well How old are you now? Jonesy? Can I ask?
Guest: Jonesy 35:05
Oh so now I’m 35
M. Martin Mapoma 35:07
so this is a while ago
Guest: Jonesy 35:08
yeah, yeah, I was I was 19 at the time How did it affect me? Well I don’t know I guess it I’m not afraid of any environment anymore after that I mean, how can you be you know, I to me that was entering you know, being stripped and sprayed and given sandals and a toothbrush sent into this room and open the door and all eyes on me like that all that shit. I mean, that’s like out of a nightmare like a nightmare. And I still have nightmares about that moment. You know, when I walked silently around and up the stairs into my cell and everybody just watching like this new new meat in the first
M. Martin Mapoma 35:48
fresh fish on the line of can’t pass this
Guest: Jonesy 35:50
and looking like I looked at that time, you know, like that was. I probably weighed 125 pounds and things, things slipping. mean I got long hair? Like, um, you know that moment is, in my mind. It’s like, so I was never been more frightened than that time. Like, how can I be more scared than that any environment I’ve been in since then. And I’m talking about even being on stage at stand up comedy like, what are you going to do to me? I’ve already been, I already thought I was going to be raped already, like by a bunch of people. I already thought that that was going to happen. You know, I expected it to happen. Also how like being raped by a bunch of dudes. Like, what are you going to do to me? How are you going to frighten me after that? I’ve had that moment already. You know, it’s like, it’s the gun up to your head.
M. Martin Mapoma 36:36
Yeah. Was it pretty? diverse?
Guest: Jonesy 36:39
I was one of the only white people in there and then
M. Martin Mapoma 36:43
so the pimp was black?
Guest: Jonesy 36:44
Yeah, yeah, Easy Lee Coleman.
M. Martin Mapoma 36:46
You ever try to look him up?
Guest: Jonesy 36:47
I did. I did. I tried to look them up on Facebook and I can never find the guy I tried to look up, Janice. Not that they would even remember me. I don’t know. I really don’t know. But I was. I was so grateful for Easy Lee that I wanted to try and find him years down the road and I was never able to I hope I don’t even my question alive
M. Martin Mapoma 37:03
yeah my question though is did you did you get a phone call? Did you call your parents or anybody or…?
Guest: Jonesy 37:08
So I did call my parents but I waited till the last day because I just wanted to see if I could just get the hell out of there without without letting them know you know so well yeah cuz yes so I got them on the phone and they they said well, can we what can we do can we bail you out? What What is it so it we had a plan the plan was they were gonna wire Western Union cash to Angela, my friend and she was gonna pick it up and bring it to the jail and get and get me out. Just me fuck John. John has like on his own, you know,
M. Martin Mapoma 37:38
Are you still friends with that guy?
Guest: Jonesy 37:39
I am not friends with him. And really, we just kind of kind of acquaintances. He lives in Philadelphia and he’s a pastor now.
M. Martin Mapoma 37:49
What is up with that, dude, that happens so much?
Guest: Jonesy 37:53
Yeah, I mean, he’s somebody who went into crime and drugs and addiction and then came out with Jesus saving him. And now he’s, he’s spreading the Jesus software.
M. Martin Mapoma 38:04
I’m always I’m always leery of people. I did. I’m always very cautious of people like that.
Guest: Jonesy 38:08
Sure, sure. I mean, but it’s like anything else, you know, whatever it is that you find what, whatever your salvation was, is something you’re going to now try and and you know, you’re going to try and spread that software. So it could be Jesus. It could be sports, it could be whatever the hell it is everybody you know, people find their thing. And you just kind of look at it like that. That’s that’s their software and it saved them good for them. Not for me, you know, it’s a little annoying when they try and press it upon you. But like, you know, so good fit for this guy, whatever you got whatever gets you over what you were doing back then because I saw firsthand that he was a very self destructive individual. He was suicidal and depressed and all these things. And I was he dragged me into that world. And so whatever got him out of that good for him, then good for him. You know, it’s a little it was a little freaky when he would leave messages on my parents answering machine years later, like, Hey, this is john and i just want to say God bless you in Jesus loves you have Chris called me and john called and he said, Jesus love you like it
M. Martin Mapoma 39:10
was funny, but I have been there before. Yeah, it’s it’s Yeah, when he you know.
Koji Sakai 39:14
So where have you been? Have you been to jail before?
M. Martin Mapoma 39:16
No, no, no, I’ve been
hanging out with some people but just you know, just a bad influence on you that I was gonna
Koji Sakai 39:23
share. The first time I was in. I was locked up in place I remember
M. Martin Mapoma 39:27
You have not been locked. Koji.
Koji Sakai 39:28
I was in high school and I remember thinking like, all I could hear was Snoop Dogg songs. I could just see I heard like all the gangster rap Snoop Dogg sighs I was like, Fuck, man. I listen to the shit too much. I was I didn’t I was not in a general I was more of a like, you know, like, I was like in a holding cell. So we weren’t that many people that
Guest: Jonesy 39:47
what what did you do?
Koji Sakai 39:48
I gotta fights and some stuff. And I was hanging out with bad people. But like, but yeah, I mean, I was fine. I ultimately I was just in the car with people who are doing really bad things.
M. Martin Mapoma 39:59
This is all funny because They want to know if anybody who’s that hard like hard, like, you know, south to South Side, Chicago or you know, you know, someone living I don’t know, I don’t wanna be stereotypical but someone like him, you know, in South Los Angeles, listen to the story. They’re probably like, nigga, please.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai
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